Tag Archives: Job 12

June 12, 2024 Bible Study — Do Not Use Deception to Argue on Behalf of God

Today, I am reading and commenting on  Job 11-15.

I often struggle with the Book of Job because the things Job’s friends say have a lot of truth to them, but God condemns them roundly at the end of the book.  However, today I noticed that when Zophar responds to Job, her responds to a straw man, he takes something Job said and paraphrases it to make it more extreme than what Job actually said.  Zophar claims that Job said that his beliefs were flawless, but that is not what Job said.  Job did say that he was blameless, and that is not true because the Bible makes clear that all have sinned.  However, in the context one might take Job’s statement as meaning that he was no more worthy of blame than his friends, who were not suffering as he was.  Zophar went on to insult Job by essentially calling him witless.  Zophar was there to offer Job comfort in his suffering, so he should not have misstated Job’s argument, and he most certainly should not have insulted him.  Job replies by pointing out that Zophar was speaking for God dishonestly, something we should never do.  Further, Job put his claims of innocent in context by asking his friends how they would fair if God were to examine them in detail, would they show any more innocent than Job?  When our friend, or anyone else for that matter, is suffering we should not condemn them,  Also, when we debate others, something which we should save for a time when they are not suffering, we should be careful to argue against positions they actually hold, not what we think they meant by what they said.

I use the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

June 12, 2023 Bible Study — Sometimes People Draw The Wrong Conclusion From True Statements

Today, I am reading and commenting on  Job 11-15.

I have been trying to decide what to write about today’s passage for a few hours now.  I first thought to write that Job’s friends illustrate the lesson that those who are wrong can make arguments which sound convincing and right.  That is definitely true here: Job’s friends make some good points, but they were in the wrong, the argument they were making was wrong.  Then, I realized that while Job was closer to the truth than his friends, he was also wrong.  Job’s friends thought that because he was suffering, he was obviously a sinner, and because they were not suffering, they were obviously more righteous than he.  They thought they were better than him.  Job, on the other hand, challenged God’s justice and demanded that God explain to him why he was suffering.  So, I thought as I read this that this passage teaches us two things.  First, just because someone builds their argument using true statements does not mean that their conclusion is correct.  Second, just because someone reaches an incorrect conclusion does not mean that none of their arguments are valid.

I use the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

June 12, 2022 Bible Study — We Cannot Tell From Surface Appearances Whether Someone Is Righteous Or Wicked

Today, I am reading and commenting on  Job 11-15.

I struggle with what to write about today’s passage.  Sometimes it feels like the Book of Job uses more words to make its point than necessary.  However, in part that is because we oversimplify the point this book is making.  The writer actually makes a very nuanced and complex point.  In today’s passage, Job’s friends essentially say that those who devote their hearts and lives to God, and only those who do so, will be wealthy and happy.  They say that the wicked are constantly tormented, and subject to sudden disasters, while the righteous never suffer such things.  Therefore, they say, we can conclude that anyone who is tormented, or subject to sudden disasters, is wicked., and those who are financially secure with stable lives must be righteous.  Job, on the other hand, expresses his desire to stand before God to be judged.  It is important to remember that at the end of the book when God speaks, while He admonishes Job for challenging His justice,  He calls upon Job’s friends to ask Job to pray for them.

I use the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

June 12, 2021 Bible Study Suffering Is Not Evidence Of Wrongdoing

Today, I am reading and commenting on  Job 11-15.

The first thing I noticed today is that Job’s friends were guilty of the straw man fallacy.  They condemn Job for things he did not actually say.  I realized that Job became angrier as he attempted to restate his argument in order to address the ways in which they had misrepresented what he had said previously.  We can actually learn an important lesson from this: do not continue a debate with someone whose counterarguments focus on, and misrepresent, our examples or side notes rather than addressing our main point.  Actually there is another lesson as well: Job’s friends were so convinced that Job’s suffering was the result of some unknown wrongdoing that they did not really listen to what he said.

I want to revisit what I said above while looking more closely at what the characters in this passage say.  Zophar misrepresents what Job said in his first monologue, then he essentially tells Job that his suffering resulted from his sinfulness; that if Job had just been righteous he would not be suffering. Jesus addresses this idea in John 9 when his disciples asked Him whether the man born blind or his parents had sinned and Jesus replies “Neither.”  Job answered Zophar’s misrepresentation of what he had said with anger and restated his original point (and also says a few things worth thinking about, but I am not going to cover those today).  Then Eliphaz condemns Job for getting angry, misrepresents what Job had said, and also implies that Job’s suffering resulted from his wickedness.  Neither Zophar nor Eliphaz specified what wickedness Job had committed; they merely postulated that his suffering was evidence of him having committed it.  The important lesson here: suffering is not evidence of wrongdoing.

I use the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

June 12, 2020 Bible Study Do Not Use the Pretense of Offering Comfort As an Excuse to Accuse Those Who Suffer

I am using the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

Today, I am reading and commenting on Job 11-15.

It is tempting to think that the Book of Job is just about realizing that just because someone is suffering does not mean that they have committed some heinous sin.  However, if that was all it was about, it would not need to be as long as it is.  Zophar voices another of the mistakes which we can make.  He tells Job that all he needs to do to end his depression and suffering is lift his hands to God in prayer and leave all iniquity behind him.  Zophar says that if Job does that, his life will be joyful once more.  Elsewhere in the Bible we see that there is something to this idea, but the context here reveals to us that it is not completely true.  Job’s response to Zophar should show us that when attempting to comfort those who are suffering sometimes it is better to remain silent than to offer what we think are solutions, but are really accusations.

In several of Job’s responses to his friends we see foreshadowing of Jesus’ ministry.  In yesterday’s passage, Job asked for a mediator between himself and God.  A role which Jesus died on the cross to take.  In today’s passage, Job tells us that if the dead can live again, then he could have hope in the anguish he suffered.  Further, Job tells us that if the dead can live again, God would guard our steps and cover over our sins.  Jesus rose from the dead to fulfill that very hope.

 

June 12, 2019 Bible Study — Only If The Dead Can Live Again, Can We Have Hope

I am using the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

Today, I am reading and commenting on Job 11-15.

Zophar’s response shows us the perils of being involved in a debate with more than one person.  He takes what Job has said to counter the other two and answers it from a different direction.  Zophar says one thing which is true for all of us, God punishes us far less than we deserve.  The problem is that Zophar’s statement is aimed solely at Job and does not include himself.  Zophar’s whole statement is that Job is suffering because he is a sinner and all Job needs to do to stop suffering is stop sinning, confess his sins, and beg God for forgiveness.  Then all will be lilies and roses.  Zophar does not actually know what sins Job has committed.  He just “knows” that he must have committed some heinous sin to be suffering as he is.  The main point of this book is that suffering is not always evidence that someone committed a great sin. 

Job’s next monologue contains many truths.  First, several times he says something his friends should have said themselves and that each of us should keep in mind: Job’s friends were no better than he.  And, what they were saying was not something known only to them.  I strive to remember both of these things.  I believe that I am pretty good at making people aware that I do not think I am better than they, but I struggle to remember that others often know the same insights which have come to me. 

In this monologue Job asks a rhetorical question, “Can the dead live again?”  He is sure that the answer is no, but he says something from which those who believe in the death and resurrection of Christ take great comfort.  If the dead can live again, then we have a basis for hope when we suffer.  And since Christ rose from the dead we know that the dead can indeed live again.  We know that death is not the end, so we can endure suffering knowing that even if it leads to death, God will raise us again to live with Him.

When Eliphaz first spoke, he made minor errors.  This time he gets too caught up in convincing Job that he is wrong.  Previously, Eliphaz had merely suggested that Job had sinned.  This time he makes it a full-blown accusation.  Yet, he cannot site what terrible sin Job has committed.  He has judged Job guilty of some terrible, unknown sin just because Job is suffering.  Eliphaz makes one true statement in this monologue: no man is truly pure, all have sinned.  However, he fails to see that this means that he also has sinned and is just as deserving of suffering as Job. 

 

June 12, 2018 Bible Study — Offering Comfort to Those Suffering From Depression

I am using the daily Bible reading schedule from “The Bible.net” for my daily Bible reading.

Today, I am reading and commenting on Job 11-15.

    As I begin reading this I am reminded of a post by a friend on Facebook about suicide awareness which I saw this morning, expressing their struggle with depression. In today’s passage the third of Job’s friends replies to him. Zophar tells Job that he deserves to suffer and almost certainly deserves to suffer even more than he is. According to Zophar only the wicked suffer, while the godly always lead pleasant lives. Even if this was not wrong, it would be a terrible thing to say to someone whose suffering is already causing them to flirt with the idea of dying, as Job’s previous comments make clear is true of Job. However, Job responds by telling Zophar, and the other two, that they are no better than he. And this is one of the first things we must make clear when we confront those whose sin is causing their suffering: I am no better than you. Actually, that is a message for us to communicate to anyone who is suffering.

    AS I further read Job’s response to Zophar I am struck by how often some of what he says is echoed by those who are suicidal. All too often we mock those who are struggling and provide a push to those who contemplating taking their own life. While at the same time allowing those who bring harm to others to live in peace. It would be better for us to remain silent in the presence of those who are suffering than to give them the same useless advice proffered by Job’s friends.

    I mentioned yesterday that I struggle with reading the Book of Job because of the need to keep in mind what God says to the people in it at the end. Well, in many ways that is a good reason to read through the book time and again, the book contains a lot for us to learn. And this brings us to another passage in it which I struggle to write about clearly:

Can the dead live again?
   If so, this would give me hope through all my years of struggle,
   and I would eagerly await the release of death.
You would call and I would answer,
   and you would yearn for me, your handiwork.
For then you would guard my steps,
   instead of watching for my sins.
My sins would be sealed in a pouch,
   and you would cover my guilt.

Job started this with a rhetorical question for which he thought the answer was “No”. He then goes on to tell us how things would be different for those suffering from depression if the answer was “Yes”. And that is the wonderful thing because, in Christ, the answer is indeed, “Yes, the dead can live again.” Which means that we do not need to fear death. In fact we can embrace our coming death because what awaits us beyond it is so much better. But there is more to it than that, because the dead can live again, God yearns for us and guards our steps. He has sealed our sins in a pouch and has covered our sins with the blood of Jesus.